Nootropics

Buy List

Nootropics Depot

• Racetam????
• Milk Thistle???
• Tart Cherry??? Magnesium???
• Ayurveda stuff???
• Reishi - 8:1 Dual Extract - 180 for $74 @ 500. Or regular $39.99 for 180 @ 500mg
• Chaga - Much cheaper at Real Mushrooms, but they charge $40 delivery currently...
• GS15-4 Panax Ginseng - $34.99 for 60 @ 200mg. Kind of pricey and not available in larger sizes for some reason. Haven't price compared. They have cheaper root/leaf extracts but only in powder.
• Ashwagandha
  • KSM-66 ($24.99 for 180 @ 300mg)
  • Sensoril - (24.99 for 180 @ 125mg) - But only half the strength of the one I have been getting... Costs the same so it's twice as expensive $/mg. Although I'm not sure about the 'Natural Factors' brand.
• Rhodiola
  • Rhodiola crenulata - $20.99 for 120 (500mg). On sale. Has no rosavins but 3% Salidroside, reports seem to indicate it gives more energy (also more energy than the %3 Salidroside Rosea they also sell).
• NAC - N-Acetyl L-Cysteine ($24.99 for 180 @ 500mg) Slightly cheaper at iHerb (ND prices are in USD, about the same price but 20 less pills).
• NALT - N-Acetyl L-Tyrosine ($26.99 for 240 @ 350mg) ($35.08 AUD) - Slightly cheaper per pill and in a larger container.
• L-Theanine 200mg Capsules $19.99 for 180 - Stronger, more and cheaper. But I still have 2 bottles... Also I'm taking Suntheanine but it shouldn't be any different.
• Cognizin Citicoline - Not sure how this compares to CDP Citicoline Seems the same... $51.99 for 180 @ 250mg, a bit cheaper than iHerb/Jarrows and avilable in a larger size
• Alpha-GPC - ($34.99 for 180) - 150mg is half the strength of the Jarrows ones. But still cheaper if I take 2. These suck as they disintegrate outside of bottle.

Old

• L-Theanine & Caffeine
• KSM-66
• Jarrow Formulas, N-Acetyl Tyrosine, 350 mg, 120 Capsules
• Bacopa Monnieri
• 5-htp

• ALCAR/NAC
• tart cherry juice, L-Tryptophan, and magnesium.

Various

• Citicoline, CDP Choline - CDP has uradine
• Rhodiola Rosea - Reduces fatigue and stress.
• Ashwagandha - reduce stress and anxiety, lower depression symptons, reduce inflammation
• L-Tyrosine - serves as the precursor for dopamine production
• Sulbutiamine - +Dopamine transeptors
• Alpha GPC - Another choline, might be better.

Misc

• moon milk

* Hacking Motivation with Nootropics
* https://ps256.blogspot.com/p/drug-half-life-list.html

* Magnesium L-threonate (aided in sleep quality)
* Creatine (more mental stamina, not as easily fatigued)
* "have you considered Sulbutiamine? It is said to be helpful for social anxiety,"

"Mr. Happy Stack is Uridine + Choline, I'm trying to regenerate my dopamine receptors. I was finding that stimulants were no longer really boosting my productivity, when I started taking this I got a big boost in motivation and overall mood"

• For energy

Specific Nootropics

Ashwagandha

"Ashwagandha is an herb from India with a history of use of over 3000 years. Ashwagandha seems to be a reliable anxiolytic (anxiety reducer). Ashwagandha may also increase aspects of attention, but there's only preliminary evidence here. Ashwagandha's mechanism of action isn't entirely clear. Ashwagandha seems to have GABA-mimetic activity, which may account for its anxiolytic effects. Withaferin A, a major active constituent, seems to be a fairly powerful anti-inflammatory agent. Ashwagandha may also improve subclinical hypothyroidism as well as worsen hyperthyroidism.

Ashwagandha enhances GABA receptors and serotonin in the brain. It appears to work on neuron receptors, enabling GABA to connect easier. This inhibits the signals present under a stress response in the brain. Anxiety goes down.

It also has GABA-mimicking effects in the brain. Comparable to the effects of prescription benzodiazepines like lorazepam (Ativan).

• There is apparently KSM-66 which is a patented extract of Ashwagandha. Some poeple recomending it other claiming issue with libido.

• "Don't buy Swanson from Amazon, Swanson does not resell their product nor sell through Amazon. KSM-66 is a specific extraction of Ashwagandha that contains the advertised amount of active compounds. Although Swanson probably sources a good Ashwagandha product, it is unknown how much of it is actually useful."

• (swanson) ship internationally directly. Buy directly from them to ensure product quality. KSM-66 standardizes to at least 5% Withanolides, and entirely removes Witharferin A (the toxin that is natural to Ashwagandha). Sensoril, another standardized formulation, uses an extract of both the root and leaves, standardizes to 10% Withanolides, but has a slightly different effect due to compounds found in the leaves that aren't in the root. I can't find the % of Withanolides in powdered Ashwagandha root, but it seems to be a fraction of a percent. Any good standardized extract (such as one of those two) should be a far more effective dose in a much smaller size.

• "I switched from KSM to Sensoril and I like Sensoril much better. No irritability and much more consistent effects.", "I tried their Ashwagandha and it wasn't very noticeable. Sensoril is much better in my opinion.", "I tried Himalaya's Ashwagandha. But I did not get the same calming effect that I get with KSM66. So I discontinued it and switched back to KSM66"

• Negatives: Anecdotal claims of it either helping libido or causing a loss of it. Some claims of Rage other saying they where *too* calm to respond appropriately to urgent things. Causing anxiety instead of helping. Someone had an allaergy reaction (hives that went away).

Standard Dose: 300mg Ashwagandha root extract standardized to ~5% withanolides"

• One page says "Not recommended for people with Hashimoto's or Type-1 diabetes". Some say it could be used to treat Hashimoto's?. I think the warning was just because it might interferer with meds.

• [spring valley] brand is notorious for poor quality control." [1]

• "I've has very good results with L-tyrosine... I finally feel happy."

• People complaining about importance issues with it. Not sure how much of an issue it is really.

• "Ashwagandha is TERRIBLE for me. I’ve experienced rage, depression as well as derealization."

• "Ashwagandha is helping me modulate emotional responses, specifically my angry outbursts"

• "I took ashwaghanda for the entire year, It makes me more relax,better sleep and more energy,and it boosts my libido,I use it with curcumin and sometimes with rhodiola rosea or schissandra for better mental focus,and anxiety reduction"

• "I am also trying the “nightshade elimination” diet lately and I was surprised to see Ashwaganhda on the list... The theory is that Nightshades can trigger allergy-like auto-immune issues in some people. That might explain why some of us have a problem with it."

• "after long term use. I noticed that I was almost too chilled out. I started missing school assignments because deadlines would approach and I wouldn't feel any "stress" about finishing then on time. I had to discontinue my use in order to get that last minute adrenaline rush back for late night paper submissions"

• it can affect your thyroid hormone levels

• It can cause thyrotoxicosis. Only buy it from vendors that supply CoAs or patented extracts like KSM-66 and Sensoril.. Other people say they had libido issues with KSM-66 only...

• "I sleep well and it seems ash considerably reduces the hangover that Mel used to have on me."

• ""can cause anhedonia in the long term, be careful."

"What is usually recommended is that you stop taking the supplement (or reduce the amount) two to three weeks before surgery so your system is clear."

Rhodiola Rosea

• "Rhodiola can work within 30 minutes of administration and continue for at least 4-6 hours."

"Its chemical pathway provides the same effect as L-Tyrosine, but it starts working on the opposite side of the spectrum. Instead of promoting synthesis of dopamine, it regulates the activity of cortisol, the stress hormone, also known as the motivation killer."

"Diminishing returns apply here as with most things, tolerance or something like it definitely builds up. I would not rely on high-dose rhodiola as a performance enhancer in the way you would use a stimulant.

Rhodiola is my fave supplement of all time, have been using it for over 10 years, but I guarantee that the effects diminish and you'll have to cycle off it eventually.

Once your body adjusts to the dosage, I'm betting that a high dose like that is going to just give you major anxiety and jitters. Definitely happens to me. When I'm using Rhodiola, I usually take a low dose, and take a higher dosage only if I'm really adrenally wrecked, sleep deprived, tired, hungover, etc. If you want to dose twice a day, one in the early morning and one before lunch is a good schedule, otherwise you may be overstimulated in the evening."

Brands: "I always feel like NOW has such varying quality. I usually have more success with Source Natural and Thorne. Right now I have Thorne Rhodiola and effects are noticeable."

"Ashwagandha combined with Rhodiola can cancel each other out, as one is sedating while the other produces mild stimulation."

"showing that it only increases BDNF for something like 7 days, then it actually lowers it below baseline. So it would seem the catch is that it doesn't work for long and needs to be cycled at minimum"

Do not take with MAOI. "MAOI meds influence serotonin levels in the brain. So taking MAOI’s in combination with Rhodiola Rosea has the potential to cause serotonin syndrome."

"quetiapine (Seroquel) has serotonin 5-HT2 antagonist properties, but paradoxically has been reported to enhance the serotonergic effect of other serotonin modulators and contribute to serotonin syndrome"

5-HTP

• Probably best to avoid. Maybe ok short term when off cycling Rhodila?

"Taking 5-HTP, without dopamine precursors like tyrosine, for months will lead to an imbalance. Just cut the 5-HTP out or start adding in something like tyrosine on an empty stomach."

"Tyrosine does not lead to a depletion issue like 5-HTP can. Just be sure to also take Tyrosine when you plan on using 5-HTP for an extended period."

"Moreover, you want to always pair 5-HTP with a dopamine decarboxylase inhibitor like green tea extract (EGCG) so that serotonin doesn't build up in the periphery and cause heart valve issues.", "green tea extract even in fairly small doses has been strongly linked with hepatotoxicity including over 20 cases of acute liver failure in Australia alone."

"In addition, 5-HTP should not be used with antidepressants such as SSRIs and monoamine oxidase inhibitors (MAOIs) because of its known potential to cause serotonin syndrome."

"Don't use 5HTP, at least not for long periods, use L-Tryptophan"

Creatine

Personal note: Really helps muscle soreness on treadmill. Also seems to give a little bit more mental energy.

"Creatine acts as an energy buffer in the brain. It is converted into high-energy phosphocreatine in the body, which helps to create ATP. During times of activation the brain rapidly drains phosphocreatine to keep ATP levels constant.[19] Oral supplementation of creatine has been shown to increase brain creatine levels between 3.5-13.3% with the average being about 8%.[20] This additional buffer of energy may enhance performance on demanding tasks related to IQ.[21][88] For healthy young well-rested omnivores, creatine does not seem to enhance function in other domains.[22][23] For individuals who are sleep deprived creatine seems to consistently enhance executive function.[87] Although vegetarians and vegans seem to respond best to creatine supplementation, vegetarians and omnivores have comparable baseline brain creatine levels."

Standard Dose: 5 grams once in the morning with plenty of water. To increase the saturation rate take 20 grams for the first week.

Some random persons meta analysis seems to indicate it's useless...

Sulbutiamine

"Sulbutiamine is an enhanced form of Vitamin B1 (thiamine) shown to be incredibly bioavailable and cross the blood-brain barrier. After crossing the blood-brain barrier, Sulbutiamine gets to work on the cholinergic, glutamatergic, and dopamine receptors of the brain that influence mood, memory, concentration, and motivation. [6] More specifically, Sulbutiamine increases motivation by enhancing the dopamine D1 receptor density."

Can be addictive.

"It’s worth noting that sulbutiamine reports vary dramatically, and it seems possible that some people are thiamine-deficient and so would disproportionately; SilasBarta noticed little to nothing (like me), but Jimrandomh reports his life was transformed (and he suspects that his diabetes caused or exacerbated a deficiency)."

NootropicsExpert: Sulbutiamine 400mg-1000mg, 1 morning one early afternoon, not to late in the day. Tolerance can be a problem 5days on, 2 off. Fat soluble, take with oil.

Can mess with bipolar medications (quetiapine?). "Sulbutiamine can also create mood swings. Particularly if you’re bipolar or are taking bipolar medication."

L-Tyrosine

"...it serves as the precursor for dopamine production in the body. Now, typically the body can make all the tyrosine it needs from the other foods you eat, but during times of illness, stress, or exhaustion, your body might not be able to synthesize sufficient tyrosine, which directly impacts dopamine production and subsequently motivation.

Supplementing with L-Tyrosine, or its cousin N-Acetyl L-Tyrosine, can increase dopamine levels in the body, lowering stress, reducing mental fatigue, and improve creativity and motivation."

"I recommend cycling it; that’s what I do."

I take N Acetyl Cysteine to stop my mind racing, and 5htp in the evening as it helps me sleep and improves my mood.

"Make sure to take L-Tyrosine on an empty stomach, otherwise it will compete with other amino acids. I usually take it in the morning, helps with kickstarting the day too."

On ADD Study: "However, after six weeks, all patients developed a tolerance to the treatment, and their improvement stalled"

"You consume multiple grams of L-Tyrosine in your normal diet every day. It’s extremely unlikely that you’re depleting dopamine to any appreciable degree just by supplementing 5-HTP.", "But l-tyrosine in food is competing with a bunch of other amino acids and whatnot so supplementing is a lot more reliable"

Might increase risk of skin cancer and diabetes

I quit because I started feeling unmotivated and overly focused on stims. Switched to a NRI (atomoxetine), which is more natural and treats my symptoms just as good if not better. I think I have SCT, which is kinda similar to ADHD, but it seems to react better to NRIs than DNRIs.

N-Acetyl L-Tyrosine (NALT)

EDIT: Multiple sources recommend regular L-Tyrosine instead of NALT.

N-Acetyl L-Tyrosine crosses the blood brain barrier better L-Tyrosine, but more might be lost in urine.

"NALT can increase your thyroid hormones. So if you’re hyperthyroid you shouldn’t use NALT."

350mg-500mg twice a day. Water soluble. Can increase thyroid hormone. Don't use with MAOIs.

"And if you’re taking MAO inhibitors (MAOI’s) like selegiline, Azilect, Marplan or Nardil you should not use NALT. MAOI’s work in your brain and effect neurotransmitters. So using NALT in combination with MAOI’s could throw off the delicate balance of neurotransmitters needed for optimal brain health and cognition"

May boost stimulants.

Acetyl-L-Carnitine (ALCAR)

• https://au.iherb.com/c/Acetyl-L-Carnitine
• NootropicsExpert

L-Cysteine / N-Acetyl L-Cysteine (NAC)

• NootropicsExpert
• NootropicsExpert personal stack
• N-acetyl cysteine ameliorates depression-induced cognitive deficits by restoring the volumes of hippocampal subfields and associated neurochemical changes (2020)

Panax ginseng

NOTE: Might be best to avoid due to meds.

"Very powerful nootropic for people who are low energy/mentally sluggish. Quality varies immensely so you have to experiment until you find the right dosgage."

Needs to be cycled.

May effect: Diabetes meds, blood thinner, anti depressants, antipsychotics (Quitia?), stimulants (Including modafinl),

"8 weeks on, 2 weeks off. Been doing this for over 5 years, no tolerance built yet!"

In response to Rhodiola: "Also, if you prefer, you might try schizandra, rhod's more mellow cousin and probably my favorite adaptogen. Or if you want to push on the energy side of things, go with Panax ginseng."

"I took 1g of Panax Ginseng just to see what was going to happen. 10 minutes after, it was like I woke up, I could instantly focus and everything lit up, I woke up, but almost too much... I’ve tried a lot of stims and none of these has given me such effects. I can move my head left to right without any pain, and my motivation to do stuff just came back out of nowhere."

• NootropicsExpert 100mg-400mg

• "3-4 weeks then a week break."

Ginkgo biloba

"Ginkgo biloba (about 160 mg / day if I remember right): better verbal fluency, word recall, articulation (I have a little problem with that); better overal energy through the day; brainfog after lunch is almost gone."

120mg to 240mg a day.

Seems to act as a blood thinner.

• NootropicsExpert

Takes several weeks or months.

Can increase bleeding risk.

"120-240mg a day"

Bacopa Monnieri (memory/stress)

• PERSONAL NOTE: Took Baccopa Extract 450mg for 2 months without much noticeable effects.

"Bacopa is a supplement herb often used for memory or stress adaptation. Its chronic effects reportedly take many weeks to manifest, with no important acute effects."

• Apparently as good as Lorazepam (Atavin) for stress reduction while helping memory. Could this mess with Lorazepam?

Was listed on the NootropicsExpert in the 'best' category (Ginseng/Ginkgo wasn't).

"I was taking Bacopa Synapsa (less sedating than Bacopa Bacognize) and noticed I hardly felt any subjective effects of caffeine; the wakefulness promoting effect was still present, but the apparent increase in motivation, focus and mood disappeared." - There is a lot of other info about it reducing energy giving stuff.

"Take it before bed. For a little while your morning coffee will not do anything to you. As time goes on you’ll start to feel the effects again and this is a good thing anyways cause it’s letting your adrenal glands heal and re-building your dopaminergic system. I’ve read studies that show it repairs your dopamine receptors, Serotonin receptors, Acetyl-Choline, Removal of Amyloid plaques in the brain. Massively increases Glutathione. I speculate aswell that because for me personally the Bacopa gave me the DEEPEST sleep I’ve ever had that I was also getting a substantial boost of growth hormone which was revitalizing my skin to an extent where it was like glowing."

Bacopa Monnieri is an herb which has been used in Ayurvedic medicine for centuries. It's currently one of the most well tested nootropics. A 2012 review of 6 trials on Bacopa Monnieri noted large and statistically significant memory enhancing effects in older adults.[27][28] Bacopa's primary mechanism of action is still unclear, it seems be an anti-oxidant, a weak acetylcholinesterase inhibitor and a cerebral blood flow activator.[29] In animal models, Bacopa Monnieri seems to increase cortical concentrations of acetylcholine, dopamine and serotonin.[197] Bacopa Monnieri is likely to be one of the safest and most effective memory enhancers for older adults.

Standard Dose: 300mg assuming 50% bacosides once in the morning or 750mg assuming 20% bacosides

(Note: Bacopa Monnieri's memory enhancing effects appear with long-term continuous use, 8 weeks is a good minimum trial period)

"I just changed from Bacognize to Synapsa and i can confirm that Synapsa is much less sedative. With Bacognize there is that noticeable sedative effect but with Synapsa i dont feel any of that."

Warnings

Bacopa Monnieri may alter the metabolism of certain drugs by changing the activities of CYP3A4, CYP2C9 and CYP2C19.[232] This may reduce the safety and effectiveness of other drugs you are taking. Talk to your doctor if you're on any prescription medications.

• NootropicsExport

Choline

• abnormally high levels of acetylcholine in the brain can cause depression and anxiety symptoms in mice.

Mr Happy Stack

• Alpha GPC and Uridine Stack

• "He forgot to mention DHA. That's the original thread for it. You also need B vitamins."

• "Mr. Happy Stack is Uridine + Choline, I'm trying to regenerate my dopamine receptors. I was finding that stimulants were no longer really boosting my productivity, when I started taking this I got a big boost in motivation and overall mood"

L-theanine

• "These effects often last 8 to 10 hours."

"L-Theanine boosts the neurotransmitters serotonin, dopamine and GABA in your brain. As well as increasing Brain-Derived Neurotrophic Factor (BDNF) and Nerve Growth Factor (NGF)."

L-theanine and caffeine.

"don't combine with anti-anxiety meds like xanax." - Ativan seems to fit into this category. More info on his blog post (seems that both effect GABA, probably ok for low dosages).

Decreases blood pressure (could mess with blood pressure meds).

200mg-400mg once or twice a day (max 1200mg). Water soluble.

Green Tea 'that's steeped correctly will offer %1-%2 L-theanine per cup. 1500mg green tea leaf will be about 30mg. A cup of green tea has 20-30mg less caffeine than coffee.

L-theanine appears to be both very safe and effective. It has a long history of use, an LD50 estimated to be over 1000 times larger than a standard therapeutic dose and no known contraindications with any food or drug. It may well be health-promoting. ref ref ref

The science behind the L-theanine-caffeine combination seems almost equally compelling. L-theanine seems to mitigate the negative aspects of caffeine, such as anxiety, increased blood pressure and diminished sleep quality, while improving upon the positive aspects. Its ability to enhance attention, over and above that of caffeine alone, has been repeatedly verified.

For beginners without a caffeine tolerance it's recommended to start with 50mg caffeine and 100mg of L-theanine. Once in the morning and once around noon.

Reddit Australia buying stuff

Reddit Nootropics L-theanine FAQ

Recommended by TekSyndicate Amazon - 22.31+7.60 shipping=$29.91 (Also get the spoons) - Ordered from here, got one close to expiry :(

BulkSupplements - Same company as the TekSyndicate Amazon one. But more pricey than others. - 2nd order from here...

PureBulk - Reddit recommended. Cheaper than Bulk

PowderCity - Also Reddit recommended, includes spoon. No 50mg, only 20mg and 100mg

"Studies on L-Theanine/caffeine synergy have been done with 100 mg L-Theanine and 50mg caffeine; you can get 50mg caffeine from about 1 and 2/3 tbsp of instant coffee or just a tad over 1/2 cup of drip coffee, but obviously experiment to see what ratio works best." - Ultimate cup of coffee (includes coconut oil)...

nootriment - "400 milligrams of L-Theanine and 100 milligrams of caffeine is a popular dose amount. For reference, the average cup of regular coffee has about 100 milligrams of caffeine."

• a Hint = 1/2 drop
• a Drop = 1/64 tsp (1/2 smidgen)
• a Smidgen = 1/32 tsp (1/2 pinch)
• a Pinch = 1/16 tsp (1/2 dash)
• a Dash = 1/8 tsp (1/2 tad)
• a Tad = 1/4 tsp

GABA

Apparently modafinl lowers this... Might be an idea to counteract it... powdercity

PQQ

PERSONAL NOTE: Tried PQQ & CoQ10 without noticeable effects.

https://nootropicsexpert.com/pqq/

YouTube: Nootropics Expert

Buy

• Quality of Life Labs, VitaPQQ, Cognitive Support, 30 Vegicaps - BioPPQ 10mg, MicroActive CoQ10 100mg - 30 for $33
• Jarrow Formulas, PQQ (Pyrroloquinoline Quinone), 20 mg, 60 Capsules - BioPPQ - Jarrow Formulas 20mg, 60capsules (20mg is for antiaging based on quality of life labs VitaPQQ variant?).
• Jarrow Formulas, Ubiquinol, QH - Absorb + PQQ, 60 Softgels - Ubiquinol/BioPQQ, $71.51 for 60.

CoQ10 (Coenzyme Q10)

https://nootropicsexpert.com/coenzyme-q10/

"There are two types of CoQ10 used in CoQ10 supplements: ubiquinone and Ubiquinol. " "Over 25 and you’re better off with Ubiquinol."

YouTube: NooTropics Expert

Vinpocetine

https://nootropicsexpert.com/vinpocetine/#how-does-vinpocetine-feel

Mushrooms

Cordyceps

• Come in a 1:1 and 10:1. 10:1 is more potent but might loose some beta-glucans?. info from Nootrpoics Depot
• Host Defence keeps getting crap for being mycelium grown on rice apparently meaning very little content.
• CS-4 is raw mycelium grown in liquid.

Lion's Mane

• There is a more expensive 8:1 extract. Nootropics Depot